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Post by christhephd on Mar 21, 2011 0:42:30 GMT -5
How you know Frank killed himself, i doubt it, he is not that type.
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Post by christhephd on Mar 21, 2011 0:54:13 GMT -5
You are correct on all points, BTW thats the actress real hair , Marge wears a wig, also to the guy who said Ben runs homeplus with Don, why would Don do something as run a company with an 18 year kid with no college?The ending was ok, not great, too many stories not touched on, sloppy writing. I'm still going through the different emotions of the grieving process - I'm ANGRY at Margene because EVERYTHING is HER FAULT - if Margene wouldn't have lied about her age Bill wouldn't have been facing Rape Charges the only thing he wouldn't plead guilty to - and IF MARGENE WOULDN'T HAVE BEFRIENDED PAM CARL WOULDN'T HAVE SHOT BILL. Margene's family told her from the very beginning to stay away from Pam: BUT MARGENE INSISTED TO BEFRIEND PAM - Margene lied to Pam about being a widow due to her husband being killed in the gulf war; then lied that she was a surrogate mother - THEN Margene gets Pam wrapped up in GOJI with no regard to Pam's home situation - MARGENE WAS WARNED Barb told Margene that she (Margene) was interfering in a marriage (Pam & Carl's) & Pam told Margene how horrible her relationship was when Margene told Pam that she was pulling out of GOJI. SO - I'M ANGRY AT MARGENE! I'm also angry at Margene that she is leaving her children behind to be Margene Without Borders -- I don't think that is really growing up. I think it's cute that Margene cut her hair short similar to Lois cutting her hair short after Lois' daughter died. I think it's cute that Margene is meeting new people, seeing the world - a world that according to Margene GOJI introduced her to - this makes me angry too REALLY MARGENE GOJI INTRODUCED YOU TO THE WORLD, HOW ABOUT GIVING HER FAMILY THE CREDIT FOR ALWAYS SUPPORTING HER. But, right now, I don't think Margene going on 3 month missions is growing up - growing up is accepting your life & Margene's priority should be her 3 children. Yes, Margene was too young to be married & become a mother - but these are the choices she made. I think Margene's three young children could give a flying flip about their mother seeing the world & sharing herself with new people - I think Margene's three young children would want their mother along with stability especially after the murder of their father. My feelings about Margene will probably change - but right now - NICKI IS THE SMARTEST WIFE - Nicki didn't vote for Margene to become a wife because Nicki didn't think she was ready for the type of responsibility living The Principle takes - NICKI WAS RIGHT! I feel as though Barb will never marry again - I think Barb may have a close companion maybe even more than one - but I don't think Barb will marry again. I think that Nicki will marry again & have more children. I don't think Margene will have anymore children. I don't think Barb, Nicki, or Margene will ever live The Principle again.
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Post by christhephd on Mar 21, 2011 0:59:27 GMT -5
HUh , Carl had money saved Margene had Pam invest 20 grand in GOJI, go back and watch the episodes, Pam made no money in that company, she spent reckless and Utah is a small state and we don't even know what Carl did for a living. Marge caused most of the problems there, she walked away from Goji, what money did she make out of it? She was no responsible at all. I'm still going through the different emotions of the grieving process - I'm ANGRY at Margene because EVERYTHING is HER FAULT - if Margene wouldn't have lied about her age Bill wouldn't have been facing Rape Charges the only thing he wouldn't plead guilty to - and IF MARGENE WOULDN'T HAVE BEFRIENDED PAM CARL WOULDN'T HAVE SHOT BILL. Margene's family told her from the very beginning to stay away from Pam: BUT MARGENE INSISTED TO BEFRIEND PAM - Margene lied to Pam about being a widow due to her husband being killed in the gulf war; then lied that she was a surrogate mother - THEN Margene gets Pam wrapped up in GOJI with no regard to Pam's home situation - MARGENE WAS WARNED Barb told Margene that she (Margene) was interfering in a marriage (Pam & Carl's) & Pam told Margene how horrible her relationship was when Margene told Pam that she was pulling out of GOJI. SO - I'M ANGRY AT MARGENE! I'm also angry at Margene that she is leaving her children behind to be Margene Without Borders -- I don't think that is really growing up. Uh... I don't think it was Margie's fault. It's not Margie's fault that Carl was so ashamed that he wasn't the "strong man" he was supposed to be as a husband... He was out of work, broke, he and his wife couldn't have children, and their relationship was going down. He was at a dead end in his life and couldn't live up to the standards a man is supposed to live up to. He went crazy. That wasn't Margene's fault... The rest of the stuff that you mentioned about Margene's history with Pam & Carl are very trivial; and i feel that they have little to nothing to do with what made Carl snap. From my point of view, he may have been a bit envious of Bill and his image as a strong family man.. Does everything himself.... including Sodding grass. Carl felt inadequate. period. You can't blame Carl's inner-demons on Margie. And as for your issues with Margene going off to be "Margene without borders".... I won't even go there.
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Post by duets on Mar 21, 2011 1:18:04 GMT -5
Thanks rissmeek, for the link. Yes I saw the wedding rings. Yeah for Ben & Heather!!
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Post by duets on Mar 21, 2011 1:27:35 GMT -5
On another note, Carl's gonna go the "clink" for murdering Bill. Barb witnessed Carl walking off (away from Bill) as she came outside after hearing the 3 shots fired. During this scene, DH said, "no one's calling 911"
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Post by albertaleon on Mar 21, 2011 1:48:44 GMT -5
Duets, I would have thought that after hearing gun shots one of the wives would have stayed inside to call 911. Maybe before running outside they told one of the kids to call 911.
Ben & Heather Henrickson - I did notice Ben wearing a wedding band when he put his arm around Heather at the large dining room table. I would have been really shocked if we then saw Ben put his other arm around Rhonda! I hope that Ben & Heather are monogamous - in the earlier season a social worker says that she ran away from a compound as a teen - when discussing children who have been kicked out from or ran away from the compound the social worker says that too often when life becomes too much to bear they fall back into the compound way of thinking - Barb agrees because Bill was thrown off the compound but reverted back to compound mentality during their darkest hours. I wonder if Ben would get a testimony to live The Principle if Heather was diagnosed with a terminal illness.
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Post by corajack on Mar 21, 2011 2:02:03 GMT -5
Margie called 911 and gave the address. It was very clearly heard in that scene. She must have had her cell phone with her.
Who "said" in the episode that no one was going to call 911? I have watched it 3 times and I never hear that line ever spoken.
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Post by bonnie on Mar 21, 2011 2:02:12 GMT -5
From one who hated this entire last season, I gotta tell you that I was very satisfied with the ending. It made perfect sense to me because I always rooted for the wives. Barb in her new car somehow struck a chord with me. I see her growing. I see them all growing.
What? Is Viagra stock going to fall now after Bill's death?
If I were Lois, and I may well be someday soon, I was happy about that ending. You kids don't yet know how it is to be getting old and to find yourself alone without anyone to watch your backs. Its frightening and depressing. Lois was lucky ... as was Frank. That was a satisfying ending.
The entire show was done right. I can't wait to watch it again and again.
I sure had my doubts throughout Season Five, but, somehow, they pulled it off at the end.
Gonna miss reading all your thoughts. You all have made my days several times over. Thank you all so much. (We sure had a great run, didn't we?)
Thank you for this message board.
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Post by duets on Mar 21, 2011 2:12:27 GMT -5
Margie called 911 and gave the address. It was very clearly heard in that scene. She must have had her cell phone with her. Who "said" in the episode that no one was going to call 911? I have watched it 3 times and I never hear that line ever spoken. Corajack, NO no no. I was referring to my DH saying that. Not anyone in the scene itself. Sorry for the confusion.
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Post by duets on Mar 21, 2011 2:17:26 GMT -5
Margie called 911 when they went outside. Thanks nychick, I was so focused upon Bill, I didn't see or hear that.
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Post by nychic on Mar 21, 2011 2:44:28 GMT -5
From one who hated this entire last season, I gotta tell you that I was very satisfied with the ending. It made perfect sense to me because I always rooted for the wives. Barb in her new car somehow struck a chord with me. I see her growing. I see them all growing. What? Is Viagra stock going to fall now after Bill's death? I agree.... I saw them growing too. I liked the way it ended. Did you notice that Nicki got a new car too? It was in her driveway. I think it symbolizes new beginnings, in a way. Out with the old and in with the new, ya know? hahaha and That Viagra joke was funny.
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Post by nychic on Mar 21, 2011 3:21:08 GMT -5
HUh , Carl had money saved Margene had Pam invest 20 grand in GOJI, go back and watch the episodes, Pam made no money in that company, she spent reckless and Utah is a small state and we don't even know what Carl did for a living. Marge caused most of the problems there, she walked away from Goji, what money did she make out of it? She was no responsible at all. @ christhephd, I tend to disagree with "Carl had money" as there was NO reference to infer that; but rather the opposite. Pam stated in last ep. that Carl is Not working & they are struggling financially & will lose their 'temple recommend due to they couldn't pay the 10% to remain in "good standing" @ the church. Furthermore, Pam stated that Carl was currently UNemployed. Your viewpoint is simply that. I would suggest you watch watch this season again to be better informed. Word of advice, Hopefully "spellcheck" will work for you, it's the 3rd button from the right @ the bottom, fyi.
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Post by limeade on Mar 21, 2011 4:48:43 GMT -5
I am more satisfied with the ending than I anticipated. After this season's run, and how abyssmal I felt about where the show was going (and not enough time to wrap things up properly), I didn't think things would end in a satisfactory manner. But they did.
Like others have mentioned, not ALL of the questions and plotlines were answered. Or shown. And that's a real shame, especially for big seasonal characters like Joey and Wanda and even Don. I would have liked to have had a two-hour series finale event to really dig in deeper to what happens to everyone, and elaborate more on the epilogue. But, it is what it is. My true focus was on getting some closure with Bill, Barb, Margie, and Nickie, anyway. I'm glad for that.
While I don't want to sound terrible, I am elated that Bill died. He may love his wives and family, and he may be doing many of his life's goals and lifepath for them, but in the end he was truly holding them back rather than letting them be free to fly, free to grow as individuals, and free to take charge of their own decisions/lives. That was a big roadblock -- the impasse. With Bill alive, none of it could have been achieved, either by his authority or his spirituality conduct.
I became very upset when Barb bailed on her baptism at the last moment. It irritated me because I thought she was going to sacrifice her own happiness and (spiritual) growth for Bill, and his demands; all that guilt tripping/crudeness that he's been doing for most of this season. But then the ending came, and Bill talked about how he made the Church 'for her', and he asked for her blessing, and everything clicked.
I felt the most emotional scene, apart from the girls hugging each other at the end, was the scene where they all go out and drive in Barb's new car. The music, the looks that spoke volumes they gave one another, the expressions... it was brilliant. These women wanted to be free, IMO. They wanted to fly, to be out there in the world, to explore and head toward new goals. Perhaps I'm reading into it, but that's what I felt the driving scene symbolized. Wind in the hair, new beginnings, chasing new heights... Just the three of them, as if it were a foreshadowing of Bill's death and only they would remain together on this road of life.
Some of the dialogue, too, I felt significant if one could read between the lines... Barb asking Margie where she wants to go, which I interpreted to possibly mean where in life she wants to go now that she's free. "No, outta town. Past the airport, way waaay out." She wants to travel, to see new things. Nickie tries to be restrained by asking for the top down, and Barb responds with, "Just relax. Enjoy the ride." She does need to relax, to enjoy life and the path one travels on. The ladies suddenly get melancholy after their shared smiles and freedoms. Barb reassures that she'll be fine on her own. Then Margie sadly wishes that they could pick up Bill and just continue driving together forever.
Whether intentional or accidental, I thought that entire scene had so many layers and meanings, and that it set the entire episode, It was truly moving for me.
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Post by samantha on Mar 21, 2011 5:50:18 GMT -5
Ben and Heather are both wearing wedding rings. That is how we know that they are married. I guess I am in the minority here, but I thought the ending was terrible. Absolute crap, actually. They clearly Chuck Cunninghamed Joey and that really angers me. We have no idea what happened to Alby and Adalene. What is going on at Juniper Creek? Why couldn't we see Cara Lynn with Greg? That would have been a better ending for her. Whose funeral were they at? My husband thinks it was Ben and Heather's wedding that we were at, but they were all in black. Mormon weddings are always white. I really can't fathom why Nicki deserves a happy ending after all the crap she has done. And JOEY! I am so mad that they never mentioned him again. Are Ben and Heather polygamists? Were they able to work that out? Maybe we were at Sara's baby's dedication or baptism, but we have no clue. I really thought that there was way too much missing. And, I guess I have a heart of stone, because I found myself saying, when Carl was talking to Bill, "I hope he takes out a gun and shoots Bill." Southernsong, you are not alone. I didn't like the final show either. But, I must admit to being conflicted with my feelings. I thought the way that Bill treated Barb was terrible. I felt so sorry for her. The way he took his clothes and was moving out of the house - he was just so mean to her. And then yelling at her for getting rid of the old car... And she was going to her church all alone - so sad. Although, I did feel sad that Bill had been killed, even though I do think he was a mean, selfish person and a jerk that had no sense of what his wives wanted and needed - just himself. Plus, I think the only reason he allowed Barb to give him the blessing was because Ben wasn't there. I also think it was stupid that they have Margie going off on that mercy cruise - give me a break! She never showed any interest in being a nurse, or the medical field - she loved sales. I would have much rather seen her starting her own business - not leaving her children for her sister wives to watch. Sorry you got married so young and didn't feel like you lived life; you have three small children to take care of; and weren't you trying to have a 4th one? Plus, wasn't she just 22 years old - plenty of time to find yourself, your life isn't over yet. I'm also sad that it ended with Nikki being the legal wife. I wanted Barb and Bill to be together and for Margie and Nikki to realize this wasn't for them but that they'd still be friends and visit with their children. Plus, if Bill had to be killed, I would have rather seen Alby or Adaleen do it because it would have made more sense then Carl. Whatever did happen to Adaleen? Alby I assume is in jail, but what about her? Oh well, it's over now. Canceling HBO today.
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Post by Katlyn on Mar 21, 2011 6:34:11 GMT -5
I never went searching for a big love forum in all the watching of seasons 1-5.
But when Bill died (WOW)... I've been crying ALOT. I'm still shocked to the core about it. I'm not sure why yet, but I've never been so emotionally hit by a characters death. I must say I truely loved the tragic ending, it will stick with me much longer than I want (lol).
Has anyone else ever had a reaction like this, to Bill or some other character? I've cried before a few times, but never more than 5-10 mins after the film ended.
After Bill died I found myself still crying some 2 hours later... even after eating half a container of icecream lol. Its really strange to feel like this, and from my googling it appears I'm in the minority to have a reaction like this. But I had to post something as the death of Bill was so freaking tramatic for some reason (sigh).
I'm going to sorely miss this series, the more I watched it the more I fell in love with the serries. They really had a wonderful and slightly insane cast of characters. I must say I look forward to Tom Hanks next brilliant set of work, right along with Bill and the rest of the cast.
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